Podcast: How Bush Brothers & Company deployed a three-phase PM optimization strategy
Key Highlights
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PM optimization improved on-time completion from ~50% to 85%, reducing reactive maintenance and stabilizing production.
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Many PMs lack value; aligning tasks to failure modes is critical to improving reliability and resource efficiency.
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Using P&IDs and pre-work streamlines PM reviews, ensuring accurate asset data and better maintenance planning.
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Separating intrusive and non-intrusive PMs boosts scheduling efficiency and increases technician productivity.
In this episode of Great Question: A Manufacturing Podcast, Plant Services chief editor Thomas Wilk speaks with Tony Peterson of Bush Brothers and Company and Jeff Shiver of People & Processes about a three-phase approach to preventive maintenance optimization and its impact on manufacturing performance. The conversation explores how improving PM accuracy, leveraging tools like P&IDs and CMMS data, and engaging technicians can shift operations from reactive to proactive maintenance. They also discuss common pitfalls in PM programs, including low-value tasks and scheduling challenges, along with strategies to improve compliance and efficiency..
Below is an excerpt from the podcast:
Thomas Wilk: Hi everyone, and welcome to a new episode of Great Question and Manufacturing Podcast. Today we come to you live from the MARCON Conference in Knoxville, TN. It's the 30th edition of this annual conference focusing on maintenance and reliability, and it's the conference that kicks off the conversation in this niche of industry every year. I'm Tom Wilk, the chief editor of Plant Services and for this podcast, I'm joined by two professionals in this industry, Tony Peterson and Jeff Shiver. Welcome, guys.
Tony, tell us a little bit about yourself, where you work, sort of what your role is there.
Tony Peterson: Yeah, I work at Bush Brothers and Company. I'm the maintenance reliability manager. I've been with the company for 25 years. Started off as a maintenance technician, worked through projects, operations manager, and then they're putting me in this role here to see if I can move the maintenance reliability program forward.
Jeff Shiver: I'm Jeff Shiver, managing principal and founder of People and Processes. We focus on improving organization's maintenance and reliability best practices.
TW: Excellent, and we're just fresh out of a session where Tony and Jeff presented ,on a project, a long-term project that Tony is running at his plant. It's a three-phase project which centered on PM optimization with another, more condition monitoring-based goal in mind if I got that right,
Tony.
TP: That's the next phase. Yep.
TW: Okay. Well, let's focus on Phase One right now. We'll give our listeners a recap of what you were doing and then how you're pointing towards Phase Three. So Phase One, you noticed there were a couple of big problems that your plant was having.
TP: Yeah, we were having issues where our production line was not consistent. Not all of it was asset reliability, but there's a good piece of it. Everything kept going back to what is our preventive program.
We knew our PMs might have not been right as we started digging into them a little bit more we started, and as we dug into them we were finding gaps in our process, in our PMs that some items were being missed that we've added over the years but we didn't update any of our PMs or documentation. Our PMs are running late, our attainment on PMs are only about 45 to 55% on time, so over half of them are not even getting done on time when originally scheduled.
And then when you start diving into that, it's just a scheduling of PMs. I couldn't give them to enough techs. I had to always give them to certain technicians or at certain times of year wasn't working out, among other things. Out of everything that could have possibly been in our maintenance program, we recognized very quickly that PMs is a great first place to start.
TW: You also mentioned that there were some indicators throughout the entire business itself, which pointed you towards the PMs. You noticed that there were a lot more folks working overtime than maybe had to be, and that there were some inconsistent business results that were happening on the plant floor.
TP: There was. Our scheduling department, as they're trying to schedule operations, you know, the production line, they were starting to have issues that they couldn't even count on the supply chain, right? You're looking at all these ingredients, all these materials coming in, but the line could not perform consistently. So we might have an item that was selling a lot, we have to produce this to get it out the door to the consumer. But in a schedule, we're struggling, so they were having to make calls within the week of jockeying the schedules around, and that just makes it very difficult for everybody. Extra changeovers for the operators, waste in some cases through that process.
So that was what's hitting our operations, but we're also seeing that our PMs were just finding components and failures, while we're finding some were only giving us two, three days. You know, I saw the PF curve, it was so far down, we just didn't have enough window there to even plan to do the work. We were constantly in reactive mode, even though it went from in the minute to maybe 2 days. So that was the biggest impact.
TW: I've been watching a lot of Star Trek lately, and I've been noticing that the episodes often center around the transporter breaking, or the phasers not firing. And that makes for good drama, but I don't necessarily want that in the plant, to get out of the break-fix mentality, right?
TP: No. And there's a whole safety element too with that. You're just putting a lot of things at risk when maintenance techs are under pressure, or operators are at the line that's down, and you're just getting out of standard work at that time which opens up the door for safety injuries.
TW: From a culture perspective, did the people that you work with, did they feel comfortable coming to you about some of the challenges they were having? Say, “hey, Tony, you know, I'm sorry, I'm missing my kids' soccer game for the overtime,” or “hey, I'm getting really frustrated because this line is supposed to work, but it breaks down too often.”
TP: What they did, once they recognized that we that we started digging into it, and we started trying to look for root cause and started digging a little deeper, it was starting to open up because we were actually in a position to listen. Not that we weren't before, but we were so busy firefighting all the time. We had to keep that line going. We didn't have the ear open as to why, right?
Once we took a little bit of a pause and started diving in, we had some people focus on the firefighting, but we just pulled a smaller group off to start digging into it. Once they saw that, it actually went really well with some really great ideas and some observations. So I think it took that, setting up that environment, things just started, for people who really want to care about their job and all that and get involved, it started coming a little naturally.
TW: And you mapped out Phase One in your presentation as really a phase that was where the people in the plant were focused on the work itself. You hadn’t really brought Jeff in yet, you hadn’t been to those workshops. And Phase One involved the P&ID diagrams in a major way too. Could you talk about how you use those physical diagrams?
TP: Yeah, we literally just got off about a six-month effort to get all of our P&ID drawings updated for the facility. We've done a lot of modifications over the years, lines and even small components. So we just got off of that. So when I pulled a group together, it says, hey, let's start focusing on PMs, our initial thought, we're just going to go through the hierarchy on our CMMS and just go one through one at a time.
Another individual who's a part of that project says, boy, the P&IDs would be just a great roadmap, because those are real, and the CMMS is what we think is right. Using P&IDs as a roadmap was huge. And we actually added assets and we actually removed assets for our CMMS on top of that. But it was a great way when everybody's in a room, they could follow the flow on the process through that. It was a great tool for that, to be a facilitating tool for helping us through that. And it just kept it organized in groups, in our P&ID areas, just really nice and focused.
TW: There was a color code system, too. Quickly, visually identifiable progress. Describe sort of how you used the colored dot system.
TP: Yeah, I can't stress enough when you've got a meeting in there and the last thing you want to do is start organizing, going through painfully each one. Okay, here's one, and then go to a CMMS and say, oh, do we have something? You're just bogging down everybody in that room, because these are long sessions, it's a lot of work. So what we did is a lot of pre-work.
We came up with a color code system. We would have somebody go through the P&ID in the area, so they would take an orange sticker and put it on every component and write down the PM number in our CMMS. We knew orange meant there is a PM for that component. Then he would go through, as you're going through the P&ID, he says, oh, there's a component. This person looks in CMMS, sees there's not a PM on that, so that was our map.
When we first came in there, we would go through, we would start with all the ones that had PMs. And then we would ask, hey, does it make sense? So we start using other data. We would look at our MES system as what kind of downtime the line was having because of that asset. What was our work order log? What kind of repairs were we even doing? And in some cases, even parts usage. So we're using that data along with the tasks to see where they’re matching up.
When it came to the ones without the PM, the red dots that did not have them, we asked the question, should we have one or not have one there at all? And really progressing into trying to understand the risk through that process. What was really interesting on that, we were disciplined enough if there was not a PM, we made a note why. So if something comes back, how come there's never a PM there? We go, this is the decision we made. Because something might have changed in the operational context of it.
So great tool, the color code system, but the key was prepping before each meeting so everybody can get right into it. You don't want to do that in the meeting because you'll waste a lot of time.
TW: You said that the pre-work really streamlined a lot.
TP: Really important. When you're pulling all your maintenance techs, these are big resources in the plan and you just want to be able to go in there and get going and again, I think a key thing was having a scribe through the whole process to be taking notes. A facilitator should not be the scribe, because while you're typing some of this intricate conversation, everybody else is sitting there, phones start coming out and everything. So we have a really good scribe coach on what we're trying to accomplish there, and they're actually taking notes while you're talking, and it just really flowed nice. Because you look at a 40-hour exercise and maintenance techs in a room, they don't like that too much, but they got a lot out of it.
TW: And I've got past meetings going through my head where the facilitator tried to be the scribe and it just wasn't working.
JS: Just a little tip on that now with artificial intelligence, you can record the conversation and transcribe all that, so you can dodge the scribe typing away in the computer piece.
TW: Have you tried that?
TP: That is on our radar to try to get more voice over and using AI, where Jeff is saying we're starting to adopt more of that in the maintenance world for sure, especially the job planner. The job planner's going on the floor and he's got a Surface Pro and he's sitting there talking to it. You know, the goal is that while he's talking, it's actually getting the notes, right? So we try to take advantage of that technology for sure.
TW: Wow, okay. Well, and I'm going to go in the timeline for Phase One and Two. Phase One, I think in the presentation you mentioned was about six months of work.
TP: Yep, 6 to 8 months, yeah, because we wanted time between each area session, again, to do some follow-up research, to give the facilitators a break, allow us to prep for the next one, and actually make the changes we all agreed on in our CMMS. The changes were made in our CMMS within three weeks of that workshop. We didn't wait till the end to do them all because we know it's just a monumental task, right? So it was really, we stayed dedicated and focused through that process there.
TW: This is a nuts and bolts question, but did you personally as a project champion take on that work of entering all the data into the CMMS or did you lean on a team where you all pitched in to get it done quicker?
TP: No, my maintenance coordinator and now my planner did a lot of that work. I focus on the facilitation and prep work, with directing somebody who can help them getting their next session ready.
TW: That's great, discrete responsibilities on this project.
TP: Oh yeah, we all knew what our job was.
TW: All right, let's move to Phase Two, this is where Jeff comes in. You said the team was making some progress, but there were some places where you were getting kind of bogged down. Maybe you can talk about that and how you brought Jeff and his team into the picture.
TP: Yeah, so we were coming off of Phase One, started seeing some really good results. Within maybe 18 months of starting Phase One, we went to about 65% on time completion rate. So again, you start doing another dive, everything's updated in the system; second dive, we noticed that we had a hard time scheduling some of these PMs as only that person knew it. Or we were getting inconsistent results from them.
So we knew there's another opportunity to take it to the next level. We said, oh, we're just going to get more detail there, so we kind of knew what we were going to do. The struggle is I brought the same team together. We started on a phase and we were chasing rabbit trails, going to places we shouldn't have went. Wordsmithing was horrible, that group there, they were always caught on words. And lastly, we defaulted writing such amount of detail in there, right, thinking that we just needed a person off the street to be able to do this.
So at least we were mature enough to sit there and say that, hey, “we need to time out here, we need to regroup.” And at the time, Jeff and the People And Processes team was working with the main plant here in Dandridge, TN, and they were having everybody go through their PMO exercise. They were having all their techs go through it for an education piece. So we said, ah, we’ll go there, and then through that workshop, they answered a lot of questions for us. And we figured out a very disciplined approach for Phase Two because it needed it.
TW: Jeff, what were some of the things that you observed when Tony brought you on board, and you saw how Phase One had gone and you saw where Phase Two was pointing?
JS: Yeah, so as we talked about, it was a much larger implementation. It started with the original plant here in Dandridge. We began with an assessment and we identified all the opportunities. We went through the planning and scheduling process. We put together the storeroom steering team or storeroom team to go after that world, and at the same time, the reliability engineering aspects for the PM optimization, if you will.
One of the sites, the local site, they began their PM optimization activities early on. But then one of the things we were trying to get them to do is begin with the education piece first so they didn't have the misstep, if you will, of Phase One. Not that Phase One didn't have value for Tony's world, but if he could have got it all in one path, one motion, that would have been a whole lot better for him from a timing perspective.
What happened was, we were doing an RCM2 intro class for that particular site here. And they said, we're going to go ahead and start PMO. And we said, okay, are you sure you want to do that? Because you're going to learn a lot of things that you probably going to make you rethink the way you approach PMO. And so they said, well, we're going to wait till September. (This is a December-January time frame.) So they went down that path and realized, just like Tony did, that they, you know, had done a lot of great things. They found PMs, for example, that didn't exist, assets that didn't exist in the CMMS, things like that.
So they were able to go do that kind of work, but they had to go back and revisit the failure modes, for example, and things like the operating context and other pieces so that they could truly understand, okay, what is the probable failure condition that those technicians are looking for? And what you often find, too, in organizations, it's very common across the world, really, 46% of the PMs that we're sending technicians out to do now actually had no value because they failed to address the likely failure modes of the asset.
Many of you, I'm sure, on the podcast, would raise your hand and say, hey, I could use more technicians, Jeff. But think about this. If 40 to 60% of your PMs had no value, we're sending people out there, we require them to do the PMs, we want 95% PM compliance, for example. Those PMs are triggering out every week, every month, every six months, whatever, and we are consuming resources, but it doesn't prevent us from failing. What I'm always amazed by is I go to sites and you'll see the supervisors sit around the table, hey, they're celebrating that 95% PM compliance, but yet I can pass the plant manager in the hall and he says, yeah, they do that, Jeff, but the equipment's still failing.
So it highlights the point of understanding the exact reasons why the equipment's failed. What are the likely failure modes that we can expect? And then addressing that from the PM program and then what indicates the potential failure condition. For example, if you use a simple example like a brake pad, at what point do we want to identify the P, the potential for failure, as opposed to the functional failure portion of that, and have enough time to go in and proactively plan and schedule the repair, get the materials, and execute it when it's convenient for operations.
So those are some of the opportunities that we saw. The other thing that you get into as well is getting everybody on board with the process. And I'll tell you that people buy into what they helped create. And that's one of the things that Tony leveraged well.
TW: Yeah, the team approach you described involved everyone that was key in the team, but also key influencers, it sounds like, too, where the word would sort of roll out among everyone what was going on.
TP: Yeah, we brought in our maintenance techs to help with that across all shifts and in Phase Two we actually brought maintenance technicians from our other plant in because it was very similar. We had the same processes but very similar equipment and say, hey, what have you had? We both learned quite a bit through that. So now when they read a PM and engineer didn't write that, I help write that. And then at the end, we're using data to help us drive “is it right or not” and we'll adjust accordingly as long we go.
TW: In the spirit of recognizing the impact these would have on people on the wider teams, one of the things you mentioned in the presentation was that part of Phase Two was to identify whether PM tasks were intrusive or non-intrusive. And you mentioned to you that was a real game changer because, #1 it helped people plan the work better, but #2, what I'm picking up with the subtext is people felt more respected. Is it going to intrude on someone's time or responsibility? How can we finesse that?
TP: Yeah, the driver of the big driver of intrusive and non-intrusive, where it was, again, another aha moment for us, we started digging into, why are these PMs late? So I might have, say, six tasks on there. There's one task that they can't do because I need the line to stop, so that PM would just sit there and sit there and sit there. So through Phase Two, more awareness, it was just a, when can you get that done? Not just the frequency, but can I do it while the line's running?
So we made an intent to say all, it's more PMs in the system, technically, but we started separating tasks that says we can do these tasks. Now my planner can schedule it, and they know the production schedule, but it's just, like you said, we're up to about 85% on time completion right now for that, because we're just, and maintenance techs know, when I get this PM, I can actually complete it because it's non-intrusive.
JS: So to add a little bit more around that, your listeners will probably recognize that as well with regard to running versus shutdown. You know, we think about intrusive versus non-intrusive, but really the goal is to schedule the technicians 100% of the available hours. So that means what are we doing when the line's running? As part of that, you know, what are these PMs that we can do, these checks that we can do while the equipment's running that actually indicate the potential for failure?
TW: Well, I've got two more areas to cover, both of them fairly brief, I think. First of it is the wrap-up metrics. What are some of the numbers that you and your team are pointing to right now where you know, okay, we're succeeding in this project?
TP: The main driver was on-time completion rate. And so that was helping us, and it's PMOs active. It's not a project. It doesn't have an end, right? And so as I keep pushing for that, my goal is 95% on time completion rate, and right now we're about 85%. So we're well on the way.
The other one is the work order compliance. Work orders complete, in our world, is completely separate from PMs. But our work orders are now at about 73% on time completion rate. It's allowing us more time to plan the work, because we're catching this stuff higher on the PF curve now, because the way they're written, through that process.
And lastly, to really look at, we're using a six-to-one ratio. So we're fortunate with our CMMS with the analytics, we were able to adopt the analytics to run a program in the background. It's just a report. When we fail a PM, it's flagged in the system. And then we’ll know “PM 123” has not had any follow-up work or has not been failed in that six-to-one ratio. We can get a report, and now we don't have to go chase everyone – the report's always there if you want to chase for the next opportunity. We don't have to do much digging, so we're trying to get some proactive analytics now to help us with that, but we're really using a six-to-one ratio, and all the techs are on board now, too, with that. They want to make sure their work's value-added.
TW: You've also gone to a state where you have a backlog of projects now, too, right? Where before it was a mostly break-fix.
TP: Absolutely. The way we used to do things, if they find something on a PM, they feel obligated, oh, it's down, I'm going to go ahead and fix it. Well, two things with that, they would never fail the PM, right? They would just create the work order and do it, and they'd just check things off on a PM or make a scribble note on the bottom. But they're also, by them fixing it, they couldn't get all their other work done because we scheduled all this work to get done.
So now the rule is that, and we kind of use a rule that Jeff and team shares, if you can't fix it in 15 minutes with tools on hand, then you got to do a follow-up work order, right? And so what that does, it actually starts creating a backlog. Either they have to fail the work order, or fail that PM, or say hey that PM's working. And then the other thing is now I've got work to actually plan and get done on schedule and I'm actually keeping my techs busier, feel more organized.
JS: One of the things if we could talk about a little bit for clarity, we talked about the RCM, we talked about two really two different approaches. We talked about an intro for RCM and then we talked about PMO. And what Tony's world was talking about really is PMO.
I mentioned doing an intro class. The intro class would be for management. When we talk about the technicians, the goal is, we have a PMO class specifically, and then immediately after class, we roll into coaching with those technicians. So the goal is not to do RCM. The goal is actually how do we improve our new strategies. And with regard to the PMO, that's better at a technician level. So we take the RCM concepts, we build them into the PMO world from the standpoint of the course exercises, the education, if you will. And then what we do is we teach them things like, you know, what are the potential failure modes, how to operate in context, all these things, relative to that.
Then take that and say, okay, let's take your PMs the next two days, two days on the education roughly, and two days on coaching to start with. And what happens is you actually use in this case, Tony's world, his PMs, and the technicians to go through those within the instructor and the coach and step through those, okay, is this really written to a level of specifications that's necessary, is it intrusive / non-intrusive, and so on. And you start to educate the technicians.
One of the things that we do too is we come back and we do additional coaching. So we can actually go back and evaluate the competency relative to PMO and structures for each technician. And then the ones that need additional coaching, we can provide that, so that way we're spooling everybody up, trying to get them to the same level, where that way it becomes a very effective organization moving forward. And as I said earlier, one of the benefits is the techs own it – they buy into it because they built it.
TW: That paves the way for Phase Three then, which is where we'll get you out of here on this one. Once you've done all the uplifting of the technicians and getting them on board with management, you're pointing towards Phase Three of this project too, right?
TP: Yeah, Phase Three, and we started tapping into it a little bit in Phase Two. I got a couple people who are really forward thinkers, and the question's been coming up is, can we eliminate the need for somebody to physically do that PM? So you start looking at go / no-go gauges or visual indicators, or of course there's just predictive technologies. So my goal is to continue to reduce the amount of PMs, because if your PMs are not organized correctly or efficiently, it is a resource hog. For example, I was able to pull my planner, scheduler, and my maintenance coordinator out of my maintenance pool without replacing those heads. So it is just that amount of work in there.
Phase Three, I really want to go from calendar-based to condition-based. And that doesn't necessarily mean PdM. It could be run hours, meter hours, units through there. And our CMMS has all that capability along with our PLC controls team. I really want to get out and let the equipment start telling me high enough in the PF curve that, hey, we got to start initiating some of these PMs out there.
Now, you're not going to get rid of all of them, you know, because we're regulated by FDA, so we got to make sure we do all those stuff accurately. But that's our next phase here to really get away from monthly, because right now even the techs are saying, I don't need to do this every month. They're kind of seeing that calendar starting to really not make sense for us, so we really want to move the condition based.
TW: Thank you guys for being here today. I know you just came out of the presentation. This was like a second recap, but I really appreciate you sharing your knowledge with our readers. And I'll put links to your LinkedIn profiles in the show notes, if that's all right with you guys. So if anybody wants to contact Tony or Jeff for more information, you can go ahead and do it. Okay. So guys, thank you so much.
TP: You bet.
JS: Thank you as well. We appreciate it, Tom.
About the Author

Thomas Wilk
editor in chief
Thomas Wilk joined Plant Services as editor in chief in 2014. Previously, Wilk was content strategist / mobile media manager at Panduit. Prior to Panduit, Tom was lead editor for Battelle Memorial Institute's Environmental Restoration team, and taught business and technical writing at Ohio State University for eight years. Tom holds a BA from the University of Illinois and an MA from Ohio State University


